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Expelled: No Intelligence Allowed

November 17, 2008 Leave a comment Go to comments

The awesome thing about the New Castle Library is their movie selection.  So, I picked up Ben Stein’s documentary “Expelled: No Intelligence Allowed” last week and was able to watch it last night.  I thoroughly enjoyed the movie and thought it was utterly amazing at some points.  Even though Ben Stein’s show on Comedy Central was about as goofy as Sonseed’s hit song, this documentary is well put together.  He talks to highly credible scientists who do not ascribe to evolution.  Hmmmm….it puts an interesting spin on what a lot of atheists say that evolution is fact and that any credible scientist would believe it.  

Dawkins even goes so far to actually sit down with Richard Dawkins for an interview.  Outside of the utterly vain and conceited remarks that Dawkins is known to make, Dawkins tells Stein that no one knows how the first cells got on the earth in order for evolution to be put into motion.  In fact, all the scientists who ascribe to this view admit they do not know the way that life began, but they do know how to run in circles in order to say that we all came from a common ancestor.  Dawkins mentioned maybe it could have been some other life form that brought it to earth….which then begs the question as to how that lifeform was began, which Dawkins says that it could have no way come from nothing.  

Holy cow, let’s get inconsistent for a minute.

Overall, I could talk for hours about this movie.  I was utterly impressed by this movie and thought it was absolutely great.  Stein exposing that there were professors at colleges who were fired for their views on ID vs. evolution shows you exactly where the scientific world stands….let’s not have anything that contradicts their view because their untestable, unobserved view is completely and totally proven and factual….I mean, if Richard Dawkins believes it, all of his followers should too, right?

Finally, I wanted to address one more thing that Stein brought to light.  There is an ever raging debate going on about how religion kills people and blah blah blah…  Yes, I’ll admit, as well as any other person in the world should admit that many people have been killed in the name of religion.  It’s an unfortunate and cruel thing.  This usually spurs people to bring up Stalin and all the other famous atheists who have killed.  This brings out that “religion kills, but atheism does not, just bad people who are atheists…”  Any way that you look at it, no one will win this argument because, well, it can’t be proven either way.  Stein does point out that the theory of evolution has brought death on millions of people though – namely the Jews in the Holocaust.  As Hitler wanted to exterminate those who weren’t worthy of life.  Those who shouldn’t reproduce.  Those who would effect that evolution of man.  In essence, Hitler wanted his own Natural Selection/Survival of the Fittest and he began with the Jews.  Hmmmm…sounds like someone killing in the name of their worldview, eh?

The debate can go on and on, and I’ll be the first to admit: there’s probably not an atheist who would see the movie and find it credible.  Just like whenever I read Dawkins’ book, and almost finished with Hitchen’s book, do I find it anything more than a bunch of atheist propaganda.  But…maybe you have an open mind…then just watch it.  For nothing more than to say you saw it.  

For Christians, I think you should watch it, because it exposes the dark side of what’s going on in the scientific world.  Basically, it seems as though the majority believes evolution, and they try to kill off anyone who opposes their view.  Ben Stein opposes their view…but I think he’s making plenty of noise to be heard.

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  1. November 17, 2008 at 11:32 am

    I hope that, even if I shared the opinion of the makers of this movie, that I would be able to admit what an atrocity it is.

    “Stein exposing that there were professors at colleges who were fired for their views on ID vs. evolution shows you exactly where the scientific world stands”

    Here’s the problem. Science isn’t ‘fair and balanced’. The truth isn’t ‘fair and balanced’. If I work at a university as a history professor and begin teaching that the Holocaust never happened, should I be allowed to keep my position? It’s the balanced thing to do, isn’t? Aren’t there two sides?

  2. November 17, 2008 at 11:38 am

    The Holocaust can be proven. Through history, through observation, through interviews, through eyewitness accounts…

  3. Dan
    November 17, 2008 at 12:07 pm

    mrakers,
    Indeed, Expelled is a disgustingly dishonest piece of propaganda. I really recommend checking out Expelled Exposed to anyone interested in something truthful.

  4. November 17, 2008 at 2:45 pm

    Dan,

    I appreciate your comments, but when Ben Stein exposes some of the views of the NCSE and their inconsistency, I can’t really validate their arguments against the movie.

    Disgustingly dishonest…much like the fact that many universities and others have fired people due to the fact that they mention ID. Simply stating that the majority believes in evolution doesn’t make it true.

  5. November 17, 2008 at 2:47 pm

    mrakers,

    And evolution is proven, through observation, genetics, comparative biology, experimentation, the fossil record…

    Show me one scientist who has lost their position due to supporting ID who is not religious, and I will entertain the possibility that ID has some science in it.

    As it is, ID is not science, and is no more valid to be taught than holocaust denial.

  6. Dan
    November 17, 2008 at 3:06 pm

    “but when Ben Stein exposes some of the views of the NCSE and their inconsistency, I can’t really validate their arguments against the movie.”

    Let me repeat myself – Have a look around on the ExpelledExposed.com website, especially here.

    Or check out the Clergy Letter Project.

    Or just the many examples of religious scientists who haven’t been “expelled”, disproving the entire premise of the movie, which Ben Stein and company pretend don’t exist.

  7. November 17, 2008 at 3:11 pm

    Here’s the interesting thing: if someone ascribes to ID, I’ll admit they are most likely going to be religious, as they see a higher power in control of things, which in my opinion would be…a form of religion as they would have a respect for this higher power.

    But, my question is: Why is it that simply because someone is religious, they are simply wrong when it comes to this? You’re working from the mindset that there is no God, therefore there is no such thing as ID. I work the other way. It’s a never ending debate. I support Ben Stein. And I love the fact that he is ruffling so many feathers in the atheist worldview.

    Propaganda? I think not. No more than Maher’s “Religulous” would be, or any other thing made by an evangelical atheist…

  8. November 17, 2008 at 3:19 pm

    And to address the issue of religious people and ID a little bit further. In discussing the the Discovery Institute, Ben Stein asks that question of the president/ceo/whatever his title is. There are religious people there, but there are also agnostics there. To claim that everyone who believes in ID is religious, would be like me saying that everyone who is an atheist is immoral…

    We just know that that’s not true.

  9. November 17, 2008 at 3:35 pm

    Dan, I looked around the site, but let me repeat: it’s the typical atheist response to anyone who attacks atheism. Dawkins, Hitchens, Dennett, Harris – they all blow the same smoke. It’s a neverending debate…

    As for the ones who haven’t been fired – great. That doesn’t negate the fact that some have though. Nowhere in the movie did Stein claim that all people who ascribe to ID get fired over their jobs…but he did reveal that some people have…which is unfair.

  10. November 17, 2008 at 3:47 pm

    Who got fired for mentioning ID in Expelled?

    Sternberg was never an employee so not only did he not get fired but he continued to enjoy the same privileges that he had before he got in trouble for bypassing the standard peer review process.

    Gonzalez simply wasn’t granted tenure. He wasn’t fired.

    Crocker’s contract wasn’t renewed. That’s not being fired but even if she was fired, it would have been totally appropriate because of the things she did teach about ID and against evolution. She didn’t simply mention it. She created atrociously misleading slides which she presented to her class (you can find them online).

    Who in the movie on the pro-ID side is a credible scientist? Berlinski is not only not-credible but has admitted that he’s a paid shill. Dembski is a mouthpiece of the Discovery Instutute who backed out of the Dover trial at the last minute because his position was going to be so brutally undermined (that didn’t keep him from charging $20,000 for his services up to that point). These people are credible? Really? Who in the movie is even an expert in biology except for some of the atheist real scientists?

    The intellectual dishonesty of the people who positively review this film is astounding. Not only do you buy into the film’s lies but you exaggerate them even further.

    The crap I’ve read about this movie from its supporters over the past year (since it was announced) digusts me deeply. This movie has been shown to be a fraud. It’s claims have been debunked. The lies they’ve told exposed. Yet, there are always people who will gleefully post on their blogs about how great it is that Ben Stein is telling us all this and it’s a really serious problem. No. The problem is that true science is being subverted because it conflicts with religious views. Of course, the same people railing against science and scientists are happy to reap the wards that science has given us.

  11. November 17, 2008 at 4:05 pm

    Hi Dave,

    Welcome to my blog.

    I see you ascribe to the thought that if someone is religious, that they cannot believe anything that science says. Talk about misleading….

    Someone’s contract not being renewed…you’re feeding the same lines that the university fed Stein. Call it whatever you want…they were fired.

    Again, I repeat…I love how Stein’s movie makes atheists squirm. It doesn’t undermine science in the least, it calls attention to the fact that the evolutionary evidence we have seen is simply….nothing.

    Observing a change within a species does not in the least bit prove that all humans have descended from a common ancestor. Throw in some horrible speculation that cannot be tested, then you have evolution. Stein also brilliantly sits down with Dawkins and asks him how it all began. “We don’t know…” At least he’s honest on that one.

  12. November 17, 2008 at 4:34 pm

    mrakers: Hi. It seems we’ve both posted about the same movie on the same day. And we’re both getting blasted for it. 🙂 Just wanted to encourage you: I appreciated the movie as well. I’m not saying everything Stein said was right or that the movie was expertly done; I’ve definitely seen better. But I enjoyed watching it, and it made me think. Anything that makes people think is a good thing.

    morsec0de (and other commenters): I’m not qualified to debate this, but I will confront you on one thing you said. “Evolution is proven.” No one is arguing this! Yes, evolution has been proven, but not as the origin of life. Sure, things change over time. Of course, life evolves based on its environment, nurturing, and needs. We’ve all seen this and no one is arguing with the evidence. However, none of this proves how life began. ID is a theory that explains the beginninng of existence and how life runs as a result. Did any of you watch the bonus features? It was truly fascinating how the one scientist found more answers through engineering than biology. I’m not suggesting this is conclusive evidence, but it does give cause for further investigation and discussion.

    Furthermore, ID has little to do with religion. Creationism is all about religion. ID simply says something greater than human beings started life. That could be anything — extraterrestrials, God or something yet to be discovered. We know so little of this universe, I find it arrogant to think we’re the most intelligent things around. Personally, I believe in God, but that doesn’t mean I’m stupid, naive or uneducated. It simply means I know humans are fallible and I choose to be humble in that knowledge and believe there is Someone greater who is capable of fixing our messes.

    One last thing: I find it interesting that those who believe in God are required to respect everyone who disagrees with us, but those who don’t believe in God are allowed, even encouraged to disrespect Christians. We are called gullible, irrational, ignorant and brainwashed. And those are the nicest terms for us. Let’s not get personal, people. Let’s stick to the evidence and have a reasonable, respectful discussion. Isn’t this really what Stein was trying to say? Freedom of speech without degredation.

  13. November 17, 2008 at 5:27 pm

    Stein’s movie makes atheists squirm because it is full of malicious lies and ignorance. We squirm not out of nervousness but out of disgust. We are disgusted by people who lie and manipulate in order to promote their own agendas (especially religiously motivated agendas). This is exactly what the people behind Expelled and the whole ID movement have done.

    The evidence behind common descent is so overwhelming that it is considered a fact of nature. There are mountains of evidence that are getting bigger every day in the fields of biology, paleontology, genetics and other related fields. The fact that you haven’t seen it means that you simply haven’t looked for it.

    You know nothing about evolution, apparently. Neither does Ben Stein. Yet, you both feel perfectly justified spreading your own ignorance of evolution to the public. Do you not see how dishonest this is?

    Regarding Caroline Crocker’s contract not being reviewed; the school would have been perfectly justified firing her on the spot for her behavior. Go read her teacher reviews at http://www.ratemyprofessors.com/ShowRatings.jsp?tid=649890&page=1 and see. Most of those comments came from before Expelled was even announced.

  14. November 17, 2008 at 6:12 pm

    That’s such an interesting point Dave. People who lie and manipulate in order to promote their own agendas…

    I mean, Dawkins and Hitchens don’t skew religion at all in their books. I have read them both. They’re spot on. I mean, religion poisons everything, doesn’t it? There is absolutely NOTHING GOOD that has ever come out in the name of religion. And of course, I have never seen it in person either.

    This is the hypocrisy of atheism to me. It’s easy to point out that religion has done bad things and to call religious people intolerant, but no religious person better do the same….

    Also, I find it very interesting in your arguments that you say none of those scientists were credible scientists. By whose authority do you say that? Would it be by the authority of all of the evolutionary biologists? Isn’t that a bit biased? Is it by ALL scientists who say that all of those scientists in the video are horrible? Or is it just a certain group of people who happen to disagree with the accused who claim they aren’t? Are we children, Dave? Just because someone doesn’t see your way doesn’t mean they aren’t smart.

    I am perfectly justified in spreading my views of evolution to the public. And Dave, if you feel threatened by my blog, that it will somehow change the world, you must be scared to death of Ben Stein.

    Finally, I have yet to meet atheists who agree on everything with evolutionary theory. I’ll begin to believe evolution whenever it can be proven without a shadow of a doubt…not a “well, there are minor adaptations within a species, and over a long period of time, this results in greater changes…which we cannot observe.”

  15. November 17, 2008 at 6:14 pm

    Tanya,

    Thanks for your comments. I thought the movie was great. But great movies that shake the foundations of believers of whatever worldview will always receive some sort of attention for it.

  16. November 17, 2008 at 6:42 pm

    “Why is it that simply because someone is religious, they are simply wrong when it comes to this?”

    Not at all.

    They aren’t wrong because they’re religious. They’re wrong because the only justification they have for ID is a religious one. In science, that doesn’t matter. What matters is evidence.

    You’ll notice how there was zero evidence over the course of the movie given in favor of ID. That wasn’t even their argument. Their argument was that all sides should be considered. And if that’s your stance, then teaching the Holocaust and teaching Holocaust denial is just as valid.

    These people who support ID may be very intelligent. But they’re wrong. The evidence we have backs up evolution every step of the way. If they want ID to be taught in schools, then they need to show the evidence for it. If not, then it will not be taught.

    “Let’s stick to the evidence and have a reasonable, respectful discussion. Isn’t this really what Stein was trying to say? Freedom of speech without degredation.”

    Scientists, those evil evil evolutionary bilogists, are sticking to the evidence.

    Again, if this is about freedom of speech, then please have the courage of your convictions and say that you agree the Holocaust and Holocaust denial should be taught equally.

    Teach the controversy, right?

  17. textnotspeech
    November 18, 2008 at 2:22 pm

    “Dawkins even goes so far to actually sit down with Richard Dawkins” – should be “Stein even…”

    The common ignored fact of Dawkins “alien theory” is that he only states this if he’s forced to assume that there was a creator. In this case Dawkins offers that IF we were created, it would have been by another EVOLVED being, not God. I respect your right to disagree on the details of an event that NO ONE witnessed, but you shouldn’t misquote someone to build a straw man argument. It is true that evolution does not disprove God, but evolution is so overwhelmingly successful at explaining the nature of life, it’s intellectually bankrupt to dismiss it. As far as intelligent design goes, if it belongs in schools at all, it belongs in philosophy. There are no scientific study’s that can test it. Essentially it’s the argument from incredulity – “I just can’t believe we’re all evolved from one life form, therefore God did it” – or even worse – “The bible says God created Adam and Eve, therefore evolution is wrong and God did it”. Is it so hard to see the irrationality of the intelligent design argument. But I digress, how pathetic of me to be trying to champion rational thinking on a youth pastor’s blog. If that’s not irrational, I don’t know what is.

  18. November 19, 2008 at 9:33 am

    No one forces Dawkins to assume that there is a creator.

    Interestingly enough, we find that we came about by being brought by another evolved being. Interesting, I suppose that that being was brought by another evolved being, and that one was brought….

    Lets never give clear answers.

    Evolution does no so overwhelmingly explain the nature of life. This is where your arrogance is shown heavily. If evolution was so overwhelming with its evidence…then every single person on the fact of the planet would believe it. There wouldn’t be the cases of people ascribing to ID, believing that God created humans, or anything else. But, when holes can be poked in a theory, then its obviously not overwhelming.

    And yes, how pathetic of you for coming on another’s blog being so arrogant to assume that you’re always right…

  19. November 19, 2008 at 5:40 pm

    “No one forces Dawkins to assume that there is a creator.”

    He’s referring to when Dawkins is questioned in the movie. He states that, if one must hypothetically think of some sort of intelligent designer, it makes infinitely more sense and is much more probable that those designers would be evolved beings, not a god.

    He was answering the question using a hypothetical.

    “Evolution does no so overwhelmingly explain the nature of life.”

    It actually does. I know that your religion has indoctrinated you to thinking differently, but that doesn’t change the fact that it does, indeed, explain the nature of living things.

    “If evolution was so overwhelming with its evidence…then every single person on the fact of the planet would believe it.”

    Wow…that is a MASSIVE fallacy. Called the “fallacy from popularity.”

    Whether or not someone believes something matters not at all to the truth of that thing.

    But hey, if we’re talking about fallacies, if your statement is true, how do you explain that not every single person believes in your religion?

    Religions fight against scientific advancement and understanding. It’s a fact of life. It took several hundreds of years before the Catholics apologized to Galileo! I don’t expect the religious to accept evolution any time soon.

    But they will. Or they’ll be ignored and ridiculed for not doing so, just like Holocaust deniers are today.

  20. November 19, 2008 at 5:42 pm

    “No one forces Dawkins to assume that there is a creator.”

    He’s referring to when Dawkins is questioned in the movie. He states that, if one must hypothetically think of some sort of intelligent designer, it makes infinitely more sense and is much more probable that those designers would be evolved beings, not a god.

    He was answering the question using a hypothetical.

    “Evolution does no so overwhelmingly explain the nature of life.”

    It actually does. I know that your religion has indoctrinated you to thinking differently, but that doesn’t change the fact that it does, indeed, explain the nature of living things.

    “If evolution was so overwhelming with its evidence…then every single person on the fact of the planet would believe it.”

    Wow…that is a MASSIVE fallacy. Called the “fallacy from popularity.”

    Whether or not someone believes something matters not at all to the truth of that thing.

    But hey, if we’re talking about fallacies, if your statement is true, how do you explain that not every single person believes in your religion?

    Religions fight against scientific advancement and understanding. It’s a fact of life. It took several hundreds of years before the Catholics apologized to Galileo! I don’t expect the religious to accept evolution any time soon.

    But they will. Or they’ll be ignored and ridiculed for not doing so, just like Holocaust deniers are today.

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